tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post8645653648217989547..comments2023-12-28T18:30:28.647-05:00Comments on Rites of Battle: Tank killing in the 41st Millenium: Space Marines Rolling ThunderHeretichttp://www.blogger.com/profile/14998180583172670653noreply@blogger.comBlogger9125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-68364722804226215582011-01-03T16:18:12.789-05:002011-01-03T16:18:12.789-05:00Oh, and two questions. First does the attack bike...Oh, and two questions. First does the attack bike count towards the five models needed to be a troop choice?<br /><br />Second, why 4 5 man squads instead of 2 8 man + 1 AB squads? You can split your full sized squads into a dedicated anti-tank unit and a more general unit that way? Which is cheaper? Which is better? It occurs to me if you are bumping against your max slots (like if you don't take a captain on a bike) you could use the full sized squad just so you don't take two slots, but in any other situation, would you want to?Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11779446895154364902noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-47888126060732970732011-01-03T16:12:44.638-05:002011-01-03T16:12:44.638-05:00Another way to augment this force would be to toss...Another way to augment this force would be to toss in some Land Speeder squadrons, especially a Typhoon squadron.<br /><br />Or you could field an assault squad of some kind. I think keeping with this theme would be to use the command squad on bikes, geared for close combat. Alternately, you could put a couple teleport homers on your bike squad sergeants I think and keep some terminators in reserve.<br /><br />I'm also not a fan of rifleman dreads. I'm not scared of them and when I've used them they just didn't do much for me. They can kill transports or dreads, but not fast enough. They can't kill serious tanks and MEQs get an armor save. If I am going to keep a dreadnought in my backfield, I usually prefer to give it the lascannons. It's very expensive, but it always seems like I get much more from the unit.<br /><br />Just my 2 cents.Danhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/11779446895154364902noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-32950098806157885232010-09-20T13:31:52.902-04:002010-09-20T13:31:52.902-04:00The strength 10 armor penetration 2 shot is good, ...The strength 10 armor penetration 2 shot is good, but it simply has a lower probability of hitting its target. The autocannons aren't nearly as strong or able to deny armor saves as often, but they do force your opponent to roll dice and that can be more deadly than fewer shots at lower armor penetration. I would argue that the autocannon is a better weapon against monstrous creatures because of it's ability to force multiple saving throws. Don't forget the autocannons are twin-linked so their probability of hitting is 88%, not 66%.<br /><br />Command Squads can have an invul, though they generally do not. Assault terminators are very nice, but they do have their own weaknesses, namely their standard mobility without their land raider. The raider will be targeted, even if only to slow the terminators down. Don't forget the ability of bikes to turbo-boost, granting them a three plus cover save.Heretichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14998180583172670653noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-42343374140315033322010-09-20T10:42:24.685-04:002010-09-20T10:42:24.685-04:00While yes it's mathematically only a 50/50. I...While yes it's mathematically only a 50/50. It's competing against a usual model's BS 4 which says 66% chance of hitting. That being said, the 66% chance isn't a S10 with the Ordnance rule. So I think the Vindi is still up to par as it may not hit as often, but it is more likely to hit the table than any other weapon in the army (save one or two:P). That, and unlike many of the other weapons, the vindicator is equally scary to any army, and any unit rather than a alternatives which are more scary to one type over the other.<br /><br />As for saving points for a hammer unit, there are few to choose from in the standard marine codex. Honor Guard and Van guard are pretty nice.. .really nice actually. But the points as compared to what you'd spend on the Assault Termies in the codex are a bit different. Granted you will probably be buy a LR to go with the termies, so it may even out a bit... but the non-termie options have no invuln, making them weak to heavy weapons. All in all it leaves options, but I'd suggest if the Riffleman if your thing, take two, leaving you a nice little spot for those cheap termies :DGodfreyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01135683206541776998noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-74742365682653418832010-09-19T23:51:59.744-04:002010-09-19T23:51:59.744-04:00Loki: The vindicator is a very strong anti-tank o...Loki: The vindicator is a very strong anti-tank option, but with a blast weapon you're looking at only about a 50/50 that it will stay put, slightly more that it will still hit. To me it's more of an infantry killer than a vehicle killer.<br /><br />Darkwatch: I actually don't know who came up with the name, but I did enjoy Mechwarrior 3 the one time I played it.<br /><br />CS: Very understandable that the dreads and bikes aren't your cup of tea and they aren't a lot of people's idea of what a marine army should be. I made sure to leave as much room as I could open points wise to allow for a hammer unit like you were talking about. There should be enough room to get some more anti-tank (if you feel the need) and to get a command squad on bikes, maybe even upgrade the captain to the Khan if you want Furious Charge and Hit and Run on your command hammer.<br /><br />I'll admit that Vulkan is an amazing character and will be in my marine list when (or if) it ever sees the table. It won't be the best list, but it will make the army more versatile and that, to me, is symbolizes C:SM. What it symbolizes to you is probably different.Heretichttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14998180583172670653noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-88075679228856803942010-09-19T23:33:43.767-04:002010-09-19T23:33:43.767-04:00While I praise the use of the Devastator teams, Th...While I praise the use of the Devastator teams, The Riflemen and bike squads are not my cup of tea.<br /><br />The Riflemen lack the power to deal with much more than a transport and can be dropped, in my opinion, with relative ease. Yes the bikes and Riflemen allow you to hate on 'mech, but as was discussed in "Hammertime", such a list lacks a unit that is dedicated to go forth and murdalize things, especially in close combat.<br /><br />If you want to hate 'mech with this list, I'd advocate Vulkan over a Master of the Forge, despite that the Master can ride a bike. The reason for this is Vulkan's rule which, in my opinion, is too good to ignore for the purposes of what this list is after.<br /><br />All in all, my biggest complaint is bikes in general. They just don't fit my style. They just, for whatever reason, don't feel "right" with me, but that is another matter altogether.Corvus Sanguinehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07491218531480134305noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-61719538295189208052010-09-19T18:48:09.833-04:002010-09-19T18:48:09.833-04:00The "Rifleman" Dreadnaught name seems ap...The "Rifleman" Dreadnaught name seems appropriate since it resembles the "Raider X" Destroid from Robotech which was later adapted as the "Rifleman" Battlemech from Battletech/MechWarrior. I'm glad people noticed the resemblance.Unknownhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05247806517695778261noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-30711930768986587662010-09-17T17:25:36.353-04:002010-09-17T17:25:36.353-04:00Auto cannons are an amazing weapon. They are in al...Auto cannons are an amazing weapon. They are in all my guard squads because they are cheap and they can tackle most anything with a little trouble. Plasma guns are kinda like mobile autocannos so that is why I like them (Ap2 doesn't hurt too).<br />It's hard for me to critic this article too much because I do not know the options available to the vanilla codex.Alexanderhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05699246659180747965noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-5655986553938534450.post-63954996072033017352010-09-17T09:05:26.831-04:002010-09-17T09:05:26.831-04:00Don't forget the Vindicator has a nice anti-do...Don't forget the Vindicator has a nice anti-doesn't give a crap weapon. It kills you dead no matter what you are :DGodfreyhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01135683206541776998noreply@blogger.com