Monday, July 2, 2012

The Point with 40,000 Problems

by Ishamael

So, I think that what's taken the most time out of my 40k conceptual matrix is that the distinction between 1999 and 2000 is completely and utterly stupid.

Allies are the salve for xenos that we've needed in this game, even though the rules seem to be out to just screw them 7 ways til Sunday.  Lower infantry cover saves, and who gets Skyfire is still up in the air for a lot of units, while the best Flier units are Imperial, and there is no patch on the horizon for that colossal fuck up.

Before the new book, it was Marines > Xenos overall.  Then allies came out, and it altered the landscape such that the guys at the top of the barrel didn't get much of a buff, but those at the bottom have, and quite substantially in some ways.  Tau with Imhoktep, nuff said. ;)

Then you read further into the rulebook, and it talks about how when you're at 2000 points, you have the option to include a second primary detachment, effectively doubling FoCs.  :/

This isn't hard to figure out.  The Marines were better because they were both cheaper, more effective, and got more per slot.  So...give them more slots?  Really GW?  2 HQs and 4 Troops is not hard by any stretch of the imagination for newer armies, but for those with cheap and effective fire support choices, life would be incredibly easy.  Yes, I would consider 6 individual Land Speeders, each toting a cheap Multi-Melta.  While Fliers are broken, even Tyranids could reap idiotic amounts of ass with 6 Herpes floating around, which can only be hit on a flaming 6.

Honestly, this rule is so stupid that I doubt tournaments will run with it, even if they allowed further stupidity like Fortifications.

The solution?  Unless you are wanting to get drunk, don't use this rule.  Play at 2k like it used to be, and care less about that one point distinction.


  1. The second force org is both a boom and a bust. While on one side it allows me as a nid player to be able to take more elites (I mean 6 harpies really... when you could use those points for more elites like hive guard and thropes)

    Also always keep in mind it doesn't give you more points. So expensive units will still be just as expensive and be taking up a larger chunk of your army.

  2. I brought the Harpies up due to the lack of Skyfire currently in virtually every army. Being hit only on a 6 makes them incredibly hard to hit, and they've got the capacity to annoy those units.

    With 2 FoCs, Nids would be able to field plenty more Hive Guard, which are a very cheap, incredibly effective support fire unit with plenty of cool rules.

    Naturally, people would go for Hive Guard more, and nobody wants that. :/

    Fix a codex, don't just let people bring more of one good unit.

  3. While I'm not entirely sure where I stand on the matter... it has been pretty clear for a while now that 2k is a fairly common occurrence in the tournament and or free play scene of 40k. I'm not really sure why GW decided to muck with that to the point of creating huge dynamic issues with the environment, when they could have just as easily set the limit to 2001+.

    It's clearly meant to be put into play for large scale games like Apoc, which blow through 2k fairly quickly, and besides the math of stacking levels of 2k for those really big games (like 15-30k a side... I'm at a lose.

    Then again, we have seen flier creep into standard play... It's a pretty early and unsubstantiated claim, but perhaps the rule was put in purely with Apoc. games in mind, and damn the torpedoes to the effect on the more common free and tournament play.

    Overall, I see way to much alteration to something as fundamental as what can be and can't be taken as relative to the FoC... and with all the other massive changes we're trying to wrap our heads around as a community... this was a change I think we could have very easily done without. To those it benefits, I can't really stop you from celebrating (nor would I :P) But I'd have to agree with Ishamael on this one. A left field play by GW... again.

  4. Fliers are broken until some good fix comes into play. Unfortunately, that "fix" cannot be allowing every missile launcher, cyclone, or Typhoon in the space marine books to have skyfire. If that's the case, then the advantage fliers had at being hard to hit goes away, because everyone has missiles left over from 5th. Furthermore, xenos are still screwed. :/

    Multiple primary detachments at 2k, fliers, and fortifications are all obvious and weak money grabs.

  5. Cyclones and Typhoons don't get the Skyhammer missile.

  6. Good for you? Nor do missile launchers until it's defined who can "upgrade" to get the Skyfire rule in the first place, so fliers get to be absurdly hard to kill til the fix comes in, or the community takes care of it.